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Discussion Starter #1
So among other things on my 2003 Rubicon 6 Cyl I am changing out the water pump and fan clutch with a new kit from rock auto. It was the best one they had.


The fan clutch screws onto the water pump with one big nut - I think this is the "newer style" (at least 16 years new :grin2: )!


I was wondering if anyone ever used any lock tite on the coupler nut or if there was ever any issue with them backing off??


Also looking for any tid bits on doing this - looks pretty straight forward. I decided to pull the radiator off to make more room to get the water pump, the pullys, roller tensioner, belt tensioner etc to do some preventive maintance.


Thanks LBM
 

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I've changed my fan clutch and I didn't use any thread locker, there should be no issue with the nut backing off. The fan rotation might be in a direction that keeps the nut from backing out. You did the right thing pulling the radiator, it's really easy once you've done it a couple of times (or four or five times like me :smile2:) and makes working on the front of the engine so much easier.
 

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Also looking for any tid bits on doing this - looks pretty straight forward. I decided to pull the radiator off to make more room to get the water pump, the pullys, roller tensioner, belt tensioner etc to do some preventive maintance.


Thanks LBM
I can’t remember where I got this. I think it’s called a spanner wrench. I hardly ever use it, but it is uniquely important when I do. It allows the pulley to be held while turning the nut. You may already know this, but someone may not. Does anyone have a trick without this wrench?

Side note...If you lay down your fan clutch, I learned it’s important to keep it in its vertical position because of the fluid inside. My question is if this is so important, then how do you account for the shipper or any other handler not being so cautious?
190D732C-1F55-4140-8975-3DA211D5952C.jpg
 

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I use one of those too. But have in the past had luck with a sharp rap with a 3lb hammer on the end of the wrench, too.

Have wondered the same about the viscous clutch. FSM says not to store horizontal. Mopar fan clutch comes laying horizontal in the factory packaging. Hmmm...

I put an aftermarket heavy duty replacement on my 4.0 and couldn't stand the near constant roar of the dang thing. Drove me nuts. Ordered a Mopar replacement and sanity was restored.

- DAA
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Thread Locker

After spending a couple of hours trying to get the nut broke loose and finding a way to hold the water pump I absolutely agree with you - don't use it!!!!!!~





I've changed my fan clutch and I didn't use any thread locker, there should be no issue with the nut backing off. The fan rotation might be in a direction that keeps the nut from backing out. You did the right thing pulling the radiator, it's really easy once you've done it a couple of times (or four or five times like me :smile2:) and makes working on the front of the engine so much easier.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Adjustable holder

Actually way after the fact I found this on Amazon when I did a search there. This type and a smaller adjustable type were listed along with a bunch of other holder/wrench combos. As it turned out I had the smaller type that I used as a Motorcycle clutch holder way way back in the day and it did work enough to break the nut loose.



I can’t remember where I got this. I think it’s called a spanner wrench. I hardly ever use it, but it is uniquely important when I do. It allows the pulley to be held while turning the nut. You may already know this, but someone may not. Does anyone have a trick without this wrench?

Side note...If you lay down your fan clutch, I learned it’s important to keep it in its vertical position because of the fluid inside. My question is if this is so important, then how do you account for the shipper or any other handler not being so cautious?
View attachment 70712
 

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Discussion Starter #8 (Edited)
I found in the box the water pump/fan clutch came in a little note about the fan clutch viscus fluid. It basically said the fluid would drain into the reservoir via the heat sensor so to let it run awhile and it would self level. I attached the fan then sat it upright to let it level off. It is a heavy duty thermal design fan clutch so after reading about it I suspect I will hear a bit more fan noise but after this PITA I will live with it or put the old one back on since it probably is OK. I'm doing most of this for preventive measures since I had to get down into it to fix a reoccurring loud squeal I was having a problem diagnosing. As it turned out my Alternator quit and when I got them apart both rollers were really rough rolling so hopefully changing them out will fix the problem. I just decided to change out the water pump & belt since I was there any way. Both the pump and the fan clutch seemed to be ok but I only wanted to do the job once - now I have a few good used parts for someday!



I use one of those too. But have in the past had luck with a sharp rap with a 3lb hammer on the end of the wrench, too.

Have wondered the same about the viscous clutch. FSM says not to store horizontal. Mopar fan clutch comes laying horizontal in the factory packaging. Hmmm...

I put an aftermarket heavy duty replacement on my 4.0 and couldn't stand the near constant roar of the dang thing. Drove me nuts. Ordered a Mopar replacement and sanity was restored.

- DAA
 

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Discussion Starter #9
So I did find out - after awhile of searching that there were Fan Clutch "Tools". I was using a 2" Crescent wrench that sort of worked but is a bit thick and long and gets in the way. I did an online search and found on Ebay a wrench kit that was listed for the Jeep - they were listed for between $13 & $30. Being the frugal Scotsman I am I opted for the cheapo set which was listed as fitting my jeep and BMW' and was 32mm and ordered it - came in about 3 days. As seems to be the case with me - I always get curious after the fact so I pulled out my calipers and went out and measured both fan clutch's and they turned out to be 36mm. So I decided to give Amazon a look and found a bunch of Fan Clutch Kits for sale and many were 36mm. I found a 32/36mm combo wrench for $20. There were Kits that came with a bar that hooks onto 2 bolts on the water pump to hold it but since I already had a kit I saved a couple of bucks and just got the wrench. It should be here Friday. I could of got the grinder out and ground the one I got down to fit but I decided to just keep it for something down the road. Should be easier to put it back together and since I like tools I don't mind having a couple more.
 

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OK - I kind of got caught up here & do appreciate all the input. I do have a question about coolant. I've got a bunch of cars and trucks but just about every one of them are old and use Green Antifreeze - green is what I have on hand. My Rubicon is a 2003 and it was unclear if it required the newer style or not. Good thing I looked because this jeep has what looks like red antifreeze and everything I've read said if I mix red and green it will turn to thick slime. I ordered a couple of gallons of Zerex Orange Oat Formula Dex-Cool - it says 2013 up Chrysler and 5 year/150,000 miles.


So the questions are- Is Mopar coolant Red? Will Orange and Red mix OK? I know there is some left in the block although I did stick a Jack under the rear Diff and jacked it up as far as it would go to get the coolant to run out of the water pump hole. I know there is supposed to be a block drain - I can't seem to easily find it and don't much want to hassle with getting to it. The coolant is clean so I don't think I have to keep water flushing it out - unless Red and Orange don't mix well!!!!!


Thanks - LBM
 

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I replaced my water pump about a month ago and did a bit of reading on the radiator fluid. Basically green antifreeze will not work with the stock jeep cooling system.

A lot of people recommend Zerex G05 or factory Mopar Coolant. The factor coolant is red and doesn't have specific chemicals that the green coolant has. I ended up just going to the dealer and buying 2 things of concentrate Coolant and diluting myself with distilled water. It ended up being only a small bit more than ordering the Zerex G05 from Amazon.

The part number for the Mopar Antifreeze/ Coolant is 68048953AC. 2 gallons of full concentration is enough for the system once you dilute it to 50/50.

This is for a Jeep TJ/LJ. If you have a JK then this might not work. Sorry didn't back read earlier posts.
 

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OK - I kind of got caught up here & do appreciate all the input. I do have a question about coolant. I've got a bunch of cars and trucks but just about every one of them are old and use Green Antifreeze - green is what I have on hand. My Rubicon is a 2003 and it was unclear if it required the newer style or not. Good thing I looked because this jeep has what looks like red antifreeze and everything I've read said if I mix red and green it will turn to thick slime. I ordered a couple of gallons of Zerex Orange Oat Formula Dex-Cool - it says 2013 up Chrysler and 5 year/150,000 miles.


So the questions are- Is Mopar coolant Red? Will Orange and Red mix OK? I know there is some left in the block although I did stick a Jack under the rear Diff and jacked it up as far as it would go to get the coolant to run out of the water pump hole. I know there is supposed to be a block drain - I can't seem to easily find it and don't much want to hassle with getting to it. The coolant is clean so I don't think I have to keep water flushing it out - unless Red and Orange don't mix well!!!!!


Thanks - LBM
This is from the 2003 FSM
Dex-cool is OAT
G-05 is Hybrid OAT, it contains silicates that the OAT doesn't
 

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Was reading you post and thought I would offer some info on coolants. As a 40 years in the trade mechanic I have had to deal with all this modern eco friendly coolant nonsense. Here are a few points. The Dexcool Orange is bad for paper thin aluminum heater cores and radiators especially chinese copies from parts outlets. The GM red is also bad. These things were developed to replace the use of non eco friendly ethylene glycol. The name OAT on the jug is bad. Organic Acid Technology. After a short time these coolants breakdown and turn acidic and pin hole your heater core and radiator. It is very common in Mopar vehicles to have the heater core pin holed and it is a 3000.00 repair. This is why Chrysler Jeep paid out a fortune in a class action lawsuit. If you have a jeep you are going to keep get that stiff out of it asap. Flush the system with lots of fresh water. Then refil with only 50/50 green ethylene glycol coolant. Dont believe the garbage in advertising or the manual. They have to say use the new stuff because they can not advise you to go back to the old green coolant. This first thing I do when I buy a vehicle of any year is flush out the new OAT acid coolant and replace with either prestone or napa green ethylene glycol coolant 50/50 mix. All the vehicles around here of years have it in them and are trouble free. I learned this the hard way. Never again. The green coolant is becoming hard to find these days in some areas but its out there. Also for those that are concerned with their dog licking some up from the garage floor or something they have Propylene Glycol at RV centers and some auto supply places like NAPA. It is not poisonous to kids and dogs and works very similarly to ethylene glycol. It is more expensive though. Later
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Mixing Coolant Coolers

So after puttering for a bit I often go to the web to search/learn new stuff. I did find a bunch of people that say mixing will cause it to Gel up. I did find one kind of a professional site ( don't remember the site and didn't save it) that talked about when the "changes" came about, why and what is good to do and not do. The Red can be GM or possibly Mopar. Better to not mix colors but if you mixed a colored coolant with the old style Green it would work but only for a couple of years and then change it out because the chemicals in the colored would be canceled out by the Green. Just for the heck of it I spilled a couple of cups or so of the Orange Zerex OAT into container of the Red I took out and sloshed it around to mix. I did not see any gelling. I let it sit for a day or so and I did not find any gelling or separating - in fact I could not see any change - it basically still just looked red - not Red & Orange.

Heck, even of the parts guy says something can be mixed I still wonder. Thanks for the detail on the fan clutch fluid.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Good Green Glycol

Very Interesting info Thanks.

In my case since I already had the Orange Oat and couldn't take it back I decided to just go ahead and use it. As Far as I can tell the Radiator and the Heater is stock - with about 180,000 miles on it and from the sticker on the Radiator it came with Probably Oat because it was "special coolant". I'm pretty sure it wasn't stock coolant since it was so clear and red - I suspect someone stuck GM in it at some time.

I did do something I usually never do and that was weigh the distilled water and coolant and split them in 1/2 before mixing them. I think I was just bored in the middle of the night since I always just split it by eye and mix it up. But it was the closest 50/50 mix I could make:smile2:

I did run a couple of gallons of plain water through to clean whatever was left of the red out. I figured there was at least a quart or two left. I was surprised when I drained out that water because it had barely a red tinge and came put real clean. I decided not to mess with running a distilled flush. There might be a little bit of "mineral water" left but I don' think it was much since it took the full 2 gallons of mix to fill every thing including the over flow bottle up to the mark. ( I did have a cup or 2 of over fill though). So if I got it right 2 gallons = 8 quarts = 16 pints???? and it is supposed to be a 14 1/2 quart system???? There is something strange there since my Owners Manual says it takes 14 1/2 Quarts to fill it?? I know there wasn't 6 quarts left and I sure didn't get 14 1/2 quarts out???:surprise:

LBM

Was reading you post and thought I would offer some info on coolants. As a 40 years in the trade mechanic I have had to deal with all this modern eco friendly coolant nonsense. Here are a few points. The Dexcool Orange is bad for paper thin aluminum heater cores and radiators especially chinese copies from parts outlets. The GM red is also bad. These things were developed to replace the use of non eco friendly ethylene glycol. The name OAT on the jug is bad. Organic Acid Technology. After a short time these coolants breakdown and turn acidic and pin hole your heater core and radiator. It is very common in Mopar vehicles to have the heater core pin holed and it is a 3000.00 repair. This is why Chrysler Jeep paid out a fortune in a class action lawsuit. If you have a jeep you are going to keep get that stiff out of it asap. Flush the system with lots of fresh water. Then refil with only 50/50 green ethylene glycol coolant. Dont believe the garbage in advertising or the manual. They have to say use the new stuff because they can not advise you to go back to the old green coolant. This first thing I do when I buy a vehicle of any year is flush out the new OAT acid coolant and replace with either prestone or napa green ethylene glycol coolant 50/50 mix. All the vehicles around here of years have it in them and are trouble free. I learned this the hard way. Never again. The green coolant is becoming hard to find these days in some areas but its out there. Also for those that are concerned with their dog licking some up from the garage floor or something they have Propylene Glycol at RV centers and some auto supply places like NAPA. It is not poisonous to kids and dogs and works very similarly to ethylene glycol. It is more expensive though. Later
 

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Discussion Starter #18
Plastic radiator and drain plug

:serious: So - my first plastic radiator - don't much like it but like the idea of changing it out less!

Every thing got put back together and hooked up just fine - except the plastic drain plug. It decided to drip drip drip - slowly and did not change when it got hot and under normal pressure. I see where a replacement plug is available from Dorfman for $5 or so - guess it is a "normal Problem!"

Any input on fixes??? Short of replacing the radiator.

Thanks LBM
 

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:serious: So - my first plastic radiator - don't much like it but like the idea of changing it out less!


Every thing got put back together and hooked up just fine - except the plastic drain plug. It decided to drip drip drip - slowly and did not change when it got hot and under normal pressure. I see where a replacement plug is available from Dorfman for $5 or so - guess it is a "normal Problem!"


Any input on fixes??? Short of replacing the radiator.



Thanks LBM
Plumber’s tape or thread sealant? Make sure it’s not wicking from somewhere else. You could run with it and see if there’s any change for the better. A drop like that would bother me if it continued. I’ve had both OEM, cheap internet type, and full aluminum. I will stick with plastic end capped OEM.
 

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Drip, Drip, Drip

Yea - it's dripping out of the drain tube. The drain plug does not seem to want to tighten up, even tried to "clock" the drain handle - one way it runs out the other way it drips. I did run a 5/16- 18 tap a little way up into the tube (same thread & size of the bolts on the water pump) and run a short bolt with gobs of Teflon thread sealer on it - this is the same stuff you put on Head bolts that are open into water jackets. A little while ago I looked and it is barely wet but is still wet. I suppose. there might be a little crack. It wasn't leaking at all when I drained the radiator - it was a bit stiff un-threading it out. I might try and find a rubber 5/16 plug - or I suppose if it bothers me enough I'll have to drain the radiator and try and keep the new coolant clean and see if Teflon tape around the plug threads will do the trick or try the Dorfman replacement works. Must be an issue if they are making a replacement part. If I can block off the entire thing I'd be happy - since it is easier to drain the whole thing to just pull off the botrtom of the lower hose.

Plumber’s tape or thread sealant? Make sure it’s not wicking from somewhere else. You could run with it and see if there’s any change for the better. A drop like that would bother me if it continued. I’ve had both OEM, cheap internet type, and full aluminum. I will stick with plastic end capped OEM.
 
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