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Discussion Starter #1
Hello fellow Rubicon/Jeep owners. I have a problem hope you can help me.

Jeep Rubican 2005, auto, stock, milage 110,000. Runs good but has thrown codes and can't pass smog.

Question:What is the problem? Is the PCM bad and needs replacement.

The history of this event.

Got an engine check light with P0153, Bank 2 sensor 1, O2 circuit slow response. Removed and replaced O2 sensor 2,1 with NTK bought from O'Riley's.

Now have all sensor codes showing bad, P0031=2,1 P0031=1,1 P0037=1,2 and P0057=2,2

Cleared codes and they returned 4 times. Did a reset by turning the key and head lights off and on, for what it's worth. Codes have again returned.

Dealer said I should have used Mopar O2 sensor so bought one and found that it is the same NTK sensor in a Mopar plastic bag that I bought at O'Riley's. So mis-information coming from the dealer. Jeep service guy wants to do a PCM flash but they did that on this jeep 2 years ago. Information about fix is inconsistent and I don't want to throw money at this riddle. If anyone can help I sure need some advice.
Thanks SierraBob
 

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Yes NTK is MOPAR OEM.

I would check the ground straps first clean/replace.

Those codes are resistance related so I would guess grounds but ...since you had one code before you changed sensor and multiple after I would check wiring , things you touched.

Check the sensor you changed make sure those wires didn't get twisted together. Ive pulled a couple out that were connected then screwed in twisting the wiring, one pulled out of a connector. Screw it in then connect it. The connectors are a pain in the ass and pulling on and moving the wires around can crack or pull on wires and connectors
 

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Discussion Starter #3
SteveV8,
What are ground straps, not familiar with that term.
I did have trouble pulling the sensor connector apart and man handled it. Other than looking at connector is there a way to test with a meter?
If I did screw up the connector that is on the wire bundle how do I replace that? Cut and splice a new one?
Thanks Bob
 

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The only time I seen 4 at a time, there was a blown fuse.
 

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Yes the heater circuit fuse is an excellent possibility, I was just looking at that. Check fuse in power distribution block on fender its a 15 amp and noted in my fsm as #16 (mines a 2004 FSM)

The relay for the heater circuit is in that box also which is another possibility.

ill look for the ground connection location for you. ground straps are just connections to the engine or components to ensure the ground path for the electrical system. The most prominent easy to see example is the flat strap from firewall to hood.

The ground connections for the harness with he o2s is on the pass side of engine just rear of the distributor/cam shaft module eyelet comes out of harness and attaches to engine block.
 

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It's also possible with those miles that you could have issues with your mini cats which are warm up cats. That is the code (0153) that started my head scratching for awhile. I replaced all of the sensors with OEM and then it would only set codes when off road. I drove it all the way to Moab, no codes. First trail, set the code. Finally the guts of one of them let go, looked like a big wad of gum and blocked the exhaust so I had no power. New warm up cats obviously solved the issue.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
All good information. I'll get right on to checking the sensor plug and fuses.

Just wondering how you can determine if the cats are good. To check the cats do I need to pull off the exhaust pipe and take a look. If the insides of the cats look intact are the cats good?
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Trying to get the stock 05 Rubicon to pass the smog test

I have read that Jeep on board computers go haywire sometimes and will keep you posted on fixing this problem for the benefit of others.

Problem all 4 O2 sensors code bad after replacing one

Checked the fuses and all seem good. Actual #16 is missing on my Jeep, 05 Rubican. Since I don't have one and no codes before this, guess I don't have to have one.

Looked for a loose ground finding nothing at this point that appears loose or faulty. I'll keep looking though.

O2 electric plugs look OK even though I broke the plastic lock off one, which really pissed me off, it still pushes snug and tight. guess I will have to safty wire to make sure it remains locked tight.

* Got talked into putting in a Mopar O2 sensor from the Jeep Dealer. As noted on the original post I changed the O2 sensor for an O'Reiily NTK. I found a chart that list the O'Reiily as a substitute rather than OEM even though the Mopar one is an NTK too and looks exactly the same it does have a different part number.

So I got to start somewhere even though I am not happy to spend $65 for a new o2 sensor and then replace it with a $85 o2 sensor:(

Cleared the codes and now driving to get data for the required smog test. If the codes come back the next step is the dealer wants to reflash the PCM.

I'll take words of wisdom from the forum. Thanks Bob
 

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What did you find was the problem? I have an 05 also that is doing the same thing. I replaced the pcm, 02 sensors map sensor and speed sensor, and continue to have problems.
 

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I have reoccurring codes p0031,037,051,057, and once in approx. 80-100 miles it throws a p0344. I have replaced all 4 02 sensors with NTK replacements and replaced OPD and cam sensor. code shows its an intermitant signal loss so have looked at grounds and have replaced negative battery cable just to verify a good ground
 

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scope the sensors and report back. The PCM will sub "known good values" in scan data, so datastream is of no use with 02 codes. The sensors are the same as all other makes, except Chrysler adds a 2.5v sensor bias to the normally 0-1v sensor signal. It's possible that the signal got pulled low due to a defective sensor. They DO have a habit of chafing the wiring at the firewall pinchweld, so check the harness above the trans. Clear DTC's and disconnect all sensors, see if you can induce codes to match your situation (ie: heater codes and low circuit codes per sensor disconnected after code clear). Holler if you need anything.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
OP here. I have been waiting after the complete fix to give a report. As the thread is active I will report what I have so far.

Bad PCM based on local shop diagnostic tests and also based on the experience of the mechanic.

I first changed out the O2 sensor with a NTK from Oriles auto parts. After installing the new O2 sensor five codes show up indicating all the O2 sensors were bad.

As I was confused and looking for help I asked the dealer and they said I needed to buy a Mopar O2 sensor. So bought a Mopar NTK and still all the codes indicated all the O2 sensors were bad. So now into O2 sensors for $65 and $100 or some thing like that. The shop charged me $98.00 for the diagnostic tests.

The shop recommended I send the PCM to BBA Remanufacturing Inc., 300 Myles Standish Blvd., Taunton, MA 02780, us.shop.bba-reman.com.

The price for repair is less than $300.00 they say. I sent it in last week and have not heard back from them yet.

I will post when I have more information.

Just a note, the mechanic told me that Jeep PSM's have a design problem. Computers only need low voltage to run and higher voltage will damage some components. Jeep PCM's have additional voltage running through it, he claims, but used for other components. I'm told the proper design is to have the computer send a signal to a relay outside of the mother board to power other devices. I don't have any first hand knowledge about this but if true then Jeep designed a headache for us.
 

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I haven't torn into a PCM but I'm wondering how they can diagnose a problem down to a component and then "repair" it. Chances are the electronics are potted in some kind of resin for heat sink purposes and to eliminate vibration-induced component failures.

On the '05-'06 PCMs (and other years?), alternator regulation is done in the PCM which probably means sinking quite a bit of alternator field current in the module (heat in other words.) Also the tranny control module is integrated into the PCM - lots of things being controlled from one box. This is for manufacturing efficiency and not ideal when there's a problem.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
OP here with update on the bad Jeep Rubicon 2005 PCM/ECU. Received a call and email from the company I sent the Jeep computer to for repair.

The PCM is the problem, bad news is it can't be repaired. Attached is the email sent to me by the repair company. I am showing you the email for a reference to anyone with a similar problem. I have purchased the remanufactured PCM from them.

Good Afternoon,

We have your ECU here for your 2005 Jeep Wrangler. Unfortunately we were unable to repair your unit. The codes are hard set into the unit and we are not able to clear or repair the unit. However, I do have one at my stock location if you are interested, the exchange unit would be $475 plus shipping. There is also a $100 fee to program the unit. We will need your correct VIN and Mileage to do so. It would come with our lifetime warranty as long as the owner stays the same of the vehicle .
Thank you,

Brianna Costa
Customer Service

1-866-573-2740

BBA-Remanufacturing USA
300 Myles Standish Blvd.
Taunton, MA 0278
 

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That's what I was expecting, but at least they confirmed the PCM is bad. Their prices are very competitive based on my research for PCMs and programming.

Thanks for the follow-up report.
 

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Wow, the PCM is spendy!
 

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Wow, the PCM is spendy!

Aren't computers neat? In that respect I sure liked my '80 CJ better, but then you look at the increase in HP and torque from basically the same engine and it help justify the modern technology. I just hope that the PCM doesn't go belly up in the middle of nowhere!
 

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Discussion Starter #20 (Edited)
OP new report, the misery continues.

Installed the remanufactored PCM from BBA and the Jeep would not start and got error code "Jeep PCM not programed." I had paid an extra $100 for programing and this was suppose to be plug and play. BBA technician said some time you need to take it to the dealer for programing. But it was suppose to be plug and play and my mechanic said it should be P+P and that's how they are sold by other internet sellers. So think they either didn't program it or the unit is defective.

The dealer said I'm to busy call me next week and I'd have to tow 30 miles and the secretary at BBA was a crank so I just sent it back. BTW no refund clause, they now say, until I send them the recipe for a replacement PCM %$#@!!

Now looking for a reputable PCM seller, again. Lots of complaints listed for these type of companies. Anyone know of a reputable PCM remanufactured I can get a PCM from?
 
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